The Powers That Be: Against the Wind, For the Water

[Edie Lindsey]

When I first heard about the proposed offshore wind farm (POWF), I didn't believe it was an idea based in reality. Sure, I love the idea of a clean, renewable source of energy, the potential of new jobs in the area, and the innovation of the idea. I even advocated wind energy when I attended elementary school, and had a windmill on the farm I grew up on.

But this project is destined to be one of the biggest boondoggles I have ever seen. I did some research. I could mention the loss of the mighty tourist dollar to the Mason-Oceana area due to the three-pronged eyesores, or the loss of property values not only to lakeshore-fronted properties, but also by extension inland-property values. I could mention the as yet unproven technology to be employed or the various accidents that have happened to other wind turbines in the past. I could mention the impact on the local fishing/aquatourism community and the hundreds of birds that would wash up ashore on our beaches each year after having been bludgeoned by that perch they saw.

But that's all unnecessary (wink), because even if this project is run according to plan and fulfills all its lofty dreams, there is the matter of comparisons and contrasts with the status quo. Our beloved, environmentally-friendly Ludington Pumped Storage Project (PSP), whose very existence makes it possible to develop and make wind farm energy feasible in this area.

1) The PSP was built between 1969-73 at a cost of $327 million (adjusted for inflation is about $1.5 billion). The POWF is scheduled to take at least 6 years to build at a cost of over $3 billion.

2) The PSP can produce up to 1872 mW of electricity during peak demand times. The POWF will be able to get up to 1000 mW, depending on the wind, which is typically less during peak demand (summer day) times.

3) The PSP is situated on less than 4 sq. miles and is surrounded by a park, a campground, and scenic overlooks. The POWF will be on 100 sq. miles of Michigan real estate, diverting public water traffic around it.

4) Annual state and local taxes collected from the PSP exceed $10 million, they put over $12 million into the area's economy, owned by power companies, and employ 41 people. Your federal and state taxes will be primarily subsidizing this effort. Historically, wind farms have given few benefits to the local area they're at, particularly when offshore.

OK, let's see what we got. The PSP puts out about twice the energy at half the cost, and demanded no existing infrastructure, like the POWF does. The POWF takes up 30 times more area, and offers its power when conditions are right, usually not at peak times. The local effect on jobs, our environment, and our economy is currently unknown for the POWF, the PSP's effects are known and overwhelmingly positive.

So why are we even considering these idiotic wind farms here? Why don't we start looking for more places to set up new pumped storage projects, the efficient, green alternative to power production?

[XLFD]

This should be required reading for all citizens of Mason and Oceana counties. Good piece, Edie; can you include some sites where you got your information, so that critical readers can do their own research?

Even though I started the LAWFULMOB group against the proposed wind farm, I would appreciate any input from those who may be inclined favorably to this project. Edie's questions are troubling, and I would like to see an attempt to answer them.

[AQUAMAN]

Sorry X, I have to go along with Edie for now. And, btw, that sharp gal is right on point on her research and statements so far. Very good job Edie, clap clap, and hats off to ya. While that PSP concept is nothing new, it sure shows us just what Edie stated, it would be alot more viable and feasible to set new PSP's up right now, than wind turbines. Or, they could find alternate places landward up north to get a wind farm going. I hope and pray the day NEVER comes when I have to look out on Lk. Mich. and see these cyclops circling for 100 sq. miles. If it does come, I will move my charter operations to another port, probably Manistee or Frankfort, or close-up shop and retire. Those artists renderings shown to the public should be PLENTY enough evidence of just what eyesores they would be.

[Max]

That's my understanding as well RJE.

[XLFD]

RJE and Max,
I looked this up under wikipedia, the PSP is a net consumer of energy, apparently, as it does require more energy to lift the water, and due to losses of water due to evaporation. The battery aspect of the PSP (energy at high demand/high cost times) is what is desirable for the wind turbines, as they could provide the energy used to pump the water. Good counterpoints.

[Max]

Yeah that makes sense XLFD. You can't get anything for nothing.

[AQUAMAN]

Could you guys provide your referenced sites of research, I'm quite interested, I had quite a few friends/dad's of friends that worked out there during the construction. Still a fascination of physics and raw energy that is/should be good reading to a Ludingtonian. I didn't read all of X's yet, it was long at the time, is that it too?

[Edie Lindsey]

Sorry, I been out for a little while doing holiday/family stuff. I must admit I did botch some of the facts regarding the PSP producing net power of 1872 mW, and didn't double check my original source, which was a brochure from the PSP (hopefully reproduced below). I am not a scientist myself, so I figured the water reversed itself up the turbines helped by capillary action, coriolis effects, anti-gravity technology, or water sprites (I'm getting into the absurd now).
But this brochure and the other Ludington PSP literature I read, never made it known to the reader that the actual energy produced, was less than the amount of energy put in. They just say that some energy is used to lift the water, and then list the benefits and capacities.
This is why we really need to learn all we can about these POWFs from all sources, not just those whose business and/or dreams are invested heavily in such a project.
The people who would benefit greatly and are trying to sell this project have already had a meeting with the local politicos and public, and have more to come. I would also like to be able to have other Europeans, Australians, and Americans who have negatively been affected by wind turbines come in also and voice their experiences and concerns about such projects.

You can find plenty on the internet by Googling around; but these are just generally normal people that couldn't afford to jet into our area and add their wisdom into the mix. Like many of you and me that are worried that our local and state government will try to spoil our area in an experiment we would like to see a little more laboratory work performed with.
LudingtonPumpedStorage.pdf

[Guidothesemipsuedocaptitalistpig]

Edie!! I do admire some of your research and most of it is very well done. But your last paragraph can be answered in two ways. One the pumped storage project is basically a giant battery allowing the power companies to pump water up into the reservoir during off peak times. When businesses are not using the full capacity of the grid usually evenings here. Then allowing the water to flow down the hill and generate power during peak times when our grid is heavily taxed usually in the mornings in the winter and afternoons in the summer. It is not a stand alone power generation facility as many believe. In fact the wind farm I am sure is also to be located unless we stop it to be the power to pump the water back up the psp penstocks for peak hours production.
So we cant attack the wind farm on this basis as it isn't a real production source. My personal opinion would be for those companies considering this to build them on land even if they have to pay a farmer a few bucks to place a tower in his field. I understand the reason they are not as many land owners in this area have been approached and turned down the idea as somehow detrimental to their use of the lands although those same people didn't seem to have an issue with the oil gas lease companies doing the same thing here back in the 70s. I do not understand why either as the bi product of gas production in Michigan is H2S gas a very nasty poison if let loose close to a human or animal population.
I completely understand those who want to fight this on the stand it will blight thier view of our great lakes we pay so much already to enjoy!! Keep up your research and inform us I will show up at any meeting I have enough forehand knowledge to attend on the behalf of those who want this stopped. I just know those who are trying have to have all their info in order so the government officials don't just impeach you as a bunch of non environmentally friendly loons.
So instead of asking for more PSPs to be built we should encourage ground based wind turbines in areas where there are very few humans to complain and the government to expand a power grid already in desperate need of expansion to those areas. My hypothesis here is based on the east coast black out which was caused basically by a glitch in a smart grid line that couldn't be compensated for due to lack of alternative transmission routes. The reason the company wants this done here is obvious we have a pre-existing terminus point to the grid and they feel there are less of us to complain as there would be if they chose say South Bend area (also a terminal point for the electric grid) Keep up the research Edie you are one of the best at presentation I have seen on here so far!

[Edie Lindsey]

This has been an interesting topic, as you say. I have seen those who support green energy up to their gills, say we can't have this on our shoreline-- and 'drill now and drill often' people come to its support. Seems to go beyond party lines.

[Guidothesemipsuedocaptitalistpig]

Actually do support energy effieciency... But I also do support drill here drill now as those two things are both necessary in our continually growing planets need to increase power production. I totally agree with your point of the wind project not producing more than a drop in the bucket of energy for all the cost involved with its building. Also Those who like the idea tend to not be folks who are even going to has to look at this monster. They live in Chicago where our current president is from.. Note he doesn't want this at his waterline either does he??? :)

[XLFD]

Good point-- hey isn't Chicago called the Windy City and don't they have that extensive skyline? Skyscraper rooftops sound like an excellent place to throw a bunch of wind turbines to me, LOL.

[XLFD]

I had a little problem uploading your 2nd attachment RJE, and haven't sifted completely through the last one yet, which is extensive.

I found another site recently "The Keepers of the Blue Ridge" that is a USA organization who are striving to protect the sanctity of the Blue Ridge Mountains in North Carolina, and proposed offshore wind farms on the Atlantic coast. Here's a link to that site, be sure to check out "Wind Energy Facts" and "Environmental Impact" pages from the main page. It will make one second guess relying on this form of energy production, and bring up points that should be debated before consideration.