Kaye Holman: Freedom of Information Fighter

[XLFD]

Ludington City Councilor at-large Kaye Holman had a couple stacks of papers at her side and made a speech at the Monday 8-13-2012 Ludington City Council meeting.  It was directed at yours truly and the Freedom of Information Act, well mostly at me.  Since I couldn't say anything at the meeting, I include my commentary in red here.  Her diatribe begins after the 26:00 mark.

"Everyone is asking me what the papers are for  [I knew it was going to be part of a visual aid.]  Tom, thanks for coming [you're welcome is what I would say if I had the opportunity to speak, but as per the rules of order, I would have to sit mute for the rest]  These two stacks of papers constitute about 90% of all the FOIAs that we have had to copy, to send to Tom, because of his Freedom of Information [Note: I have had about 30-40 copies sent to me in total, all paid for without any indigency bonus.  I ask to 'inspect' the records, which generally requires no copies to be made, they generally have opted to send it scanned to me via E-mail.  About half of the two stacks were from my one FOIA described in "Innerview with a Vamper"]

Now I believe in Freedom of Information, what that means is, yes, you can ask for it and yes we will give it to you, unless it is an open thing such as we have had lately with the Fetters and a couple of other things we just simply can't [I haven't asked the City for anything regarding the Fetters' shooting, the two investigation records I have asked for, they surely can and must if they follow the law When open governments...]  However, these are the originals of the copies that Tom has gotten [correction: over 98% that Tom has either inspected or received electronic images of.]  We have approximately $6500 in fees, $6500 in fees, but you get a credit if you're indigent (point, smirk), you get a $20 credit (point, smirk) if you're indigent [the $6500 is an arbitrary figure they get when they add in illegal costs such as attorney fees.   I have paid for all the material that I have inspected or received.  I really appreciate you dissing indigent people interested in why their government is doing corrupt acts, Ms. Holman.  Maybe next meeting I'll point to you, smirk and say wealthy, and repeat myself.]

You have approximately 150 hours included in this which includes time for the people who work here, that have to take time from their day [... to do their official duty of providing records via FOIA].  Now consider if you're a minimum wage employee, which is..., I don't even know what minimum wage is now [$7.40 an hour, do your homework, Kaye] , say you make $10 an hour, and you spend 3 hours a day, 5 days a week, that's 15 hours, that's $150 that the City is paying someone to make these copies [again, if copies are being made, they are not following my request to either inspect or receive scanned images].

And I'm sorry, but I consider this a fishing expedition [your speech?]; I think it is done to harass the City [your speech?!]; and I truly believe that or I wouldn't be standing up here [giving your speech?].  We copy actual records [when they don't need to], we have time, we have 100 of staff hours, close to a thousand of staff hours [quick math fact:  1000 hr. X $10/hour minimum wage = $10,000 minimum for these, a bit more than her arbitrary $6500 figure earlier-- is the City paying under minimum wage?  Hardly.] since this whole mess was started.

We have... this is approximately two feet, three feet, something (pointing to stack).  Normally, we get 4-6 FOIA requests per year (hand wave, repeated).  Here we are.  Attorney fees are included in this; now we do pay our City Attorney, our City Attorney is on a retainer but if he's working, and we're having to go to him with many of these if not all [let's ask ourselves why the City uses the $185/hour CA to gauge how best to dodge giving out information for most of their responses.]  Most of them-- OK so if we're paying him X amount of dollars per year [$40,000 plus $185/hr. for special projects] and I don't have those figures [I do.] and I'm not going to give you one [I can.]   If we're paying him X amount of dollars and he's having to take part of that time, and he's taking that time over a course of a year, 40 hours a week, I don't know [I do, its about 7 hrs a week, 28 hrs per month.], which is what most of us work, but because he's got to play with this mess (flourish at the papers), he's now working 50 hours a week [hmm, my less than one FOIA request per week causes the City Attorney to work 10 extra hours that week.  Wow, I had no idea...]

Don't you think, don't you think, that he's gonna say "You aren't paying me enough." [$185 an hour is plenty for these special projects.]  There we are again with the money.  It's costing the City a lot for Tom to go fishing [and I don't even have a marina slip under surveillance by the City!]  I have no idea what he uses them for [read the Ludington Torch and find out, Kaye, or curse the darkness.], I don't care [I do], I don't know [I do know], I'm sure he's not going to tell me [tell you what Kaye, I will go through my whole list of City FOIA requests next meeting and tell you exactly what I was fishing for, the reason I was fishing, and show you the fish I caught, and even the ones that got away.  I'll need more than five minutes however...] 

But I'm having a real hard time with this and that's why, because of this (points to papers), and this isn't all of it; John Shay has them all laid out on his counter and I didn't want to mess up his counter any more [... than I did at the last office party.]  The dollar rate will go up, hourly we're paying these people, and again I don't know what the average hourly rate is here [I do, once again thanks to FOIA], we'll pick the $10 figure [for City Hall workers, guess again, the lowest clerk goes for over $15, the City manager around $70 per hour].

Right back to paying and paying and paying and I frankly don't have any idea what Tom is doing with these [could it be exposing the corrupt City in action, Kaye?] , other than one of my favorite phrases (mumble) the tail is trying to wag the dog [this idiom means:  An item of minor importance dominating a situation-- I don't get it either].  And I resent that deeply, I resent that DEEPLY [I still don't get it either, even with her repeating it.]

I'm going to be here for two more years [knock on wood] and I'm probably not going to shut up (fit of cackling).  Those of you that know me, know that I take it very seriously, very, very seriously [why?], and I don't intend to stop talking about it [but I'm restricted to five minutes, is that fair?] and if I bring more of these out (points to papers) I will [no, puh-leeze not again, have mercy], because I believe it is only fair that (mumble) other than costing the City and its... it's not me, I'm a taxpayer, you're all taxpayers also, right?  Everybody in this room and the people watching are all taxpayers, we're paying for this, we're paying and paying and paying [there goes her paying ramble again], and I have to say again, I resent that deeply.  Thank you

[Wanda Marrison]

You know I meant you and Jerry. You wear the shirts to irratate him because of some meeting years ago  about "Actions unbecoming a firemen" Matter of fact I heard from Jerry himself that there was more than one meeting. Did he lie to me? Looks like you still blame him for YOUR decision to resign from the fire dept. BTW he said you were a good firefighter.

 He just reminding everyone in public in front of the camera, that you are not part of the LFD and your comments made during your 5 mins on camera wearing a LFD member shirt is not representative of the LFD.

   Just as you are implying by wearing the shirt that you have some active conection to the LFD. Don't need much of an imagine to figure that one out.

Take the the higher road end this shirt stuff. You stop he stops. Pretty simple.

[XLFD]

I encourage anyone to FOIA the Ludington Fire Department, including yourself Wanda, to see if there was any other meeting other than the one I was called in and told that I had did several things that weren't true, passed along not by the Fire Chief, but by the Ludington Police Chief Mark Barnett, who did so in total disregard for ethical behavior by a police officer. 

All because of some insignificant detail of me not coming to a complete stop at a stop sign while on my bicycle, before I crossed a clear intersection.  Let's not mention, the stop sign's legality or incorrect placement in reference to the crosswalk, and I did nothing wrong on the traffic stop, except for not showing my driver's license, ho, ho, ho. 

I will wear what I feel like wearing within the realm of legality; you nor Jerry Funk are my mother, and if it makes you uneasy seeing someone who worked for the City as a good firefighter for eight years come to you with real problems this City should be tackling, and some that they should leave well enough alone, then the shirt is doing its part. 

Tell you what:  if Chief Jerry or Mark want to take that shirt from my back they can invite me outside and try it.  But if they do, I will start wondering about their sexuality. 

[Willy]

Wanda

If someone shows pride in an orginaization and wears a shirt to show that, what business is it of yours. The juveniles in this situation are the Fire Chief who publicly shows his disdain for a former employee and a CIty Councilor [that would be you] who can't refrain from publicy rebuking a citzen who shows pride in his past. The audiance who sees the Council video only knows there is a person there who wears a shirt they are obvioulsy proud of but yours and the Chief's actions of turning it into a negative is what makes the situation ugly. You are suprising me with each post by showing your true colors.

[Wanda Marrison]

Geez. You seem to forget that I work for me too. I pay my wages, through my taxes also. Did I loose all of my tax payer's rights when I was voted onto the council. Hmmmmmmmm good question   

Looks like my right to free speech has been taken from me here.  No surprise.

[XLFD]

Your freedom of speech has in no way been taken from you Wanda, you just have been called to defend what you have said and inferred. 

Being that you cannot defend the six biggest whoppers (presented to you earlier) that your associate Kaye Holman let loose on Monday, except by counter-attack, does little to show your objectivity when you go after me for miscalling the fire chief John Henderson's father-in-law, rather than his uncle-in-law.   

[april]

LOL tell her to shut up and do her job. smh

[april]

Speaking of that can I now ask for mine from the PPO hearing?

[XLFD]

The problem is when she (and her compadres) does shut up and does her job we get a bunch of tax and fee increases, and nonsense laws about feeding cats, intruding into your house to check your pipes, taking glass containers to the park, the Workplace Safety Policy, etc.  So if she keeps flapping those lips at me, at least she's not concentrating on taking any more of everyone's property or rights away from them.  And that's good for all!

It should be available from the LPD, April.  I believe you can also view the court records (not the transcripts) from the County Clerk concerning that PPO, but you do need special permission to copy or scan them.  The clerk's office charges $1 or $2 for each copy they supply, but allows free perusal. 

I could help you do the FOIA with the LPD records, but I suggest going to the courthouse yourself for their records, which might reveal something new to you.  It sure did when I went http://ludingtoncitizen.ning.com/forum/topics/creatingamonsterpt3 

[AQUAMAN]

Good to see ya back Wanda, we missed your input. However, you're kinda coming on strong here, can you inform us of the actual facts where any misstatements have been made, and thank you. Btw, do you condone the actions and finger pointing of Holman at the last meeting? I know you guys had ice cream cones during one meeting of recent a couple of months ago, I would have thought you gals took the office more seriously that meeting, you kinda ducked out from what we heard, but that may also be a mistake, or is it? Regards.

[Wanda Marrison]

I am no stronger than the post that take place here everyday.

Only time I have had Ice cream with ANY city official was at the Ludington/Frankenmuth goverment exchange day a few weeks ago.

I am the first to leave the meetings unless someone comes to me. I don't hang around and talk

social talk with the other CC members. I choose not to socialize with other CC members.

I did not know that Kay was speaking that night. I assumed what the paper stack was when I saw it. Until I looked for myself to varife them I had no idea why they there until Kaye spoke.

Was surprised that is was done at that forum.

Lots that needed to be said from a TAX PAYER'S stance, but maybe could have been done in a better way.

 

 

 

[SomethingCompletelyDifferent]

I find it interesting that the City of Henderson, I mean Ludington, councilors would comment on any of this in a public forum, especially in the manor it is being done here. Wouldn't it be more dramatic and effective to give a public lecture, a "Holman" lecture if you will, at the next city council meeting to reprimand people about the attire they wear to a public forum? 

[XLFD]

I'm gathering the pile of actual copies I received from the City (almost all at either $.15 or $.25 a page) together for a future City Council meeting.  The kid's spiral notebook has more pages.  Hmm, I'll keep looking.